Daved Thomson

I would not be surprised if the land upon which the park sits has been sold.  I wouldn't put anything past the current Six Flags CEO!

And, amazingly, everyone paid the same price to enter the park (or had to find themselves promotional discounts), ride the rides, see the shows & attractions, and wait in lines. No buying your way to the front of the line and no surprises about arriving at a park that is supposed to be open, or is only half open.

Just another way to create problems in the guest experience.  Definitely another non-premium experience.

I think I may have mentioned this before somewhere, but I know I have waited in the cue to board the western sky ride on the two levels and have exited through the front doors.  Other than the video showing people lined up to enter through those doors, I have never seen people lined up to take the ride to the Dream Street station.  The only possibility of boarding through these front doors (and this is simply a guess), would be if these doors also connected to the lower level cue on this side of the station which contained about three switchbacks inside.  That cue has long been closed.

I also found it funny how some of the commentary about those with small children seemed to think that those children might now be "scared for life" after having seen such an atrocity.  Really?  Perhaps it was the wailing and over reaction by others that would be more likely to leave such scars.

I thought so.  Yours was somewhat contained to the head, if I recall correctly.  This, unfortunately, was a total loss and I wouldn’t be surprised if there was real damage to TS Island. Very sad. 

A fire at Disneyland Saturday night apparently broke out during a performance of Fantasmic on or near Tom Sawyer island.  At the time of this report on KABC 7, no injuries had been reported, but that section of the park which is utilized as the primary viewing area was evacuated.  

Agreed, but I think Six Flags has largely abandoned its show operations and I wonder if this would even be something consistent with any of its contracts to use the WB cartoon characters and DC comics in its parks.  The advertisement itself only had about 4 seconds worth of footage of their classic cartoon characters.  Again, though, it seems like an obvious, but missed opportunity for Six Flags to bring some of its darkened theater venues back to life.  (Not to mention cross promotional opportunities with Warner Brothers.)

Have they changed the method employees must use for entering the park as a guest when not working?  "Six Flags team members receive a free Platinum Pass" seems a  bit disingenous at best if that pass is really just the employee's I.D., especially if that Platinum Pass becomes invalid following an employees termination.  Perhaps I am just overly suspicious of press releases from a company whose leader seems to think that a premium guest experience equates to higher prices at every level for deceptively fewer rides, shows, attractions and general services.  I also have to question how honest they are being with the claim that they are "Recognized for five years as one of the Nation’s Best and Brightest Companies to Work For®" if none of those five years were under current management and I have no idea what is a "bright company."  Seems like a big helping of word salad.

1 hour ago, GAcoaster said:

With each successive management team from Time Warner onward, the maintenance budget and staff has been downsized and the park has never recovered properly. Things that other parks do to winterize and rehab the park no longer does. Look at Cedar Point- they have/had many of the same rides and they keep them in amazing shape. Every year their Ferris wheel has all the cars removed and rehabbed, then reinstalled before the park opens for the season-- it's the exact same wheel GA has but looks like new in comparison. GA used to do the same, but the lack of maintenance personnel and lack of budget means instead things only get fixed as needed rather than getting the preventative maintenance they should get. 

 

Part of the issue has always been GA's costs are higher than just about any other park because it is unionized, but it also been a bigger draw and made higher profits for the company than just about any park in the chain. 

 

I'll be curious to see if Kingda Ka gets similar modifications to Top Thrill Dragster since both are maintenance nightmares and bottomless pits of money for repair and upkeep. Supposedly the cost is about $5 million each year to keep KK running, so the ride has cost the park more than $100 million between purchase and maintenance over the past 18 years. Imagine what they could have done with that instead of dealing with Ka. If modifying it costs $10 million but it's cheaper to maintain and becomes a better and more reliable ride, maybe they update it? 

I've been saying this for years.  While I can't speak to absurd costs to maintain Kinda Ka, unions do result in greater expenses to any business.  Personally, I believe SF management (corporate and/or at the park level) began to show their true colors when they first displayed a willingness (or need) to allow so many of the park's iconic structures, as well as labor intensive features such as shows, landscaping, and grounds quality, to slip in favor of extremely expensive rollercoasters and other rides that really draw a limited audience.  

At the corporate level, the company (I think foolishly) decided to appear to expand and increase annual attendance through the acquisition of parks that were well below Six Flags standards.  I think this was most evident following the sale of the parks by Time-Warner.  Now, if this company wants to continue in the theme park industry, they need to shed all of their less than stellar parks, particularly those in smaller markets, and focus on improving the quality, upkeep, and guest experience at their largest parks and largest markets.

4 hours ago, The Master said:

If I known so much of the park was going to be closed I would not have renewed my season pass this year. Do other SF parks also have large sections closed down too? 

Sad to say, but it almost seems like Six Flags is going the route of the sleazy car dealership with a bait and switch policy when it comes to ticket sales and, especially, season pass sales.

That would be my best guess regarding Best of the West as well, and I believe I alluded to the log issue as a growing problem similar to the TeePee's somewhere in another post.  It just really saddens me when I think of how much of this park's original charm has been lost to time and inconsistent management decisions over the years

On 3/24/2023 at 9:10 AM, RobertDavid said:

More bars???? Really????

 

What happened to Best of the West? Aside from them letting it rot and crumble. it was everybody's favorite restaurant. it was the best themed restaurant. Now it is only open for exclusive events????

Couldn't agree with you more, Robert.  I've been asking these same questions, but really believe that Best of the West will be the next of the park's original iconic structures that will be lost to poor maintenance and ever changing corporate management with little interest in any long range strategies for building the park's and corporate brand.

Bars, as stand alone venues, in my opinion, are completely inappropriate for theme parks.  Sure, I can see alcoholic beverages available with meals, but even in those cases, the primary product served and focus of the restaurant would not be alcohol.

2 hours ago, 29yrswithaGApass said:

 

It will still be there but like the last few seasons openly on special days.

Any idea what the limited use of Best of the West is all about?  I fear we may soon be losing another major park icon as a result of a lack of preventive maintenance and the building's internal hardware, mainly the HVAC system that it shared with the Super TeePee.  The roof of the building always had significant leaking issues, but I know the installation of the metal roof resolved much of that problem.  At this point, I'm assuming the logs themselves are starting to pose a problem nearly 50 years later, in much the same way that the TeePee's logs became an issue.  I'm also just guessing that traffic flow in that area of the park is greatly diminished and doesn't warrant the labor costs associated with a restaurant of that size.

Forget them?  I never even heard of them.

9 hours ago, The Master said:

 

One theory I heard is that Disney used Splash Mt to salvage and rehab an otherwise unusable IP. The attraction was a way to repackage and save the Song of the South IP without the core film which become unreleasable due to politics and widespread misconceptions about the film. 

Going back to Tron and how it ended up as an attraction in any of the Disney parks, which is what I first asked, in the end, I think it turned out to be the easiest IP of Disney's to turn into an attraction given the mechanics of the ride and its ride vehicles.  Clearly Space Mountain isn't really connected to an IP, nor was Pirates of the Caribbean or many other attractions specifically tied to movies.  In fact, in the case of Pirates, it was the first time a park attraction resulted in the creation of a movie, nearly 50 years after the attraction opened.  I'm just not sure why they felt the need to tie the attraction to an IP and then to get the attraction sponsored by a Rental Car Company.

2 hours ago, 29yrswithaGApass said:

How popular was Song of the South when it first was planned in 1986 or Swiss Family Robinson today?  If I had to guess they just picked an IP that fit the newly available hardware.   

The 1946 original release of Song of the South was a box office success and the film and music received accolades as well as won an Academy Award for Best Original Song.  The black actor (Baskett) received an honorary Academy Award for his performance as Uncle Remus.  I've never heard of Splash Mountain lacking attendance at any of the parks.  The Swiss Family Robinson (assuming you're referencing the Tree House) I don't think was ever enormously popular.  But my point is that creativity with new attractions really seems to be on the decline at Disney and, like you, to me it does sound like they just picked an IP that fit the available hardware.

Curious question which is probably better asked in a Disney Parks forum.  Does anyone have any idea why this attraction was developed in the first place?  I know it first appeared in one of the Asian Disney Parks (I'm thinking China).  Beyond that, and knowing that as a movie Tron wasn't exactly a financial success for WDP, I'm sort of baffled as to why they would have pursed a ride themed to Tron for any of their parks.  I've never seen the movie and I was a junior in high school when it was released in 1982.  I understand it was enormously successful in the park in which it was first introduced, but beyond that, I just don't understand the assumption that it should be a big success in the U.S. because of the film property upon which it is based.  I have two friends who are huge WDW fans and have a timeshare with them, but even they claim they would not have waited in a traditional cue to ride Tron.  They did ride it during the preview, and each said they liked riding on the cycles, but they both found the ride to be very short for a Disney attraction and neither of them have seen the movie.  Would love to hear some other thoughts on the attraction and what others may know about it ever coming to be.

5 hours ago, pashacar said:

I also feel like they'll probably just keep the tower there....

A lot like they leave theaters, arenas, merchandise shops, games, and rides SBNO.  They don't seem to understand just how much this detracts from the atmosphere and overall experience the park offers.

Totally agree, but I actually think this is just one more instance of the man at the top not knowing the parks, their demographics, or much else.  His idea of market research seems to be asking friends of his to tell him what they think when they go to a park.  I'm getting the impression that park president's have been largely eliminated at some parks, with regional president's becoming responsible for multiple parks.  Good luck with that!

I think gold looks great on most ride vehicles.  I actually liked the repainted Lightnin' Loops trains in Black and Gold better than the original Red and Blue.  Without looking up pictures, I think that's correct.

Like yourself, I often find myself going back over the images on this website looking for hints of long gone park features.  I know you're looking for a better photo of the Kiddie Kingdom entrance arch, perhaps one where you did not have to read the entrance banner backwards.  I use an excellent, yet inexpensive, image manipulation software for macOS called GraphicConverter.  Using your photo from inside Kiddie Kingdom of the entrance arch, I simply created a horizontal mirror of that photo, showing the arch as it would have read as you entered Kiddie Kingdom.  Unfortunately, the supports on the back of the letters remain, but you can now see the arch as it would have looked as you entered.

Another hidden gem I just noticed, is the park's original parking tram circle at the original entrance to the Enchanted Forest.  Your B/W aerial of Kiddie Kingdom shows it  neatly hidden between Kiddie Kingdom and Fortune Festival/Goodtime Alley.  The tram route became a service road following the move of the park's entrance to its current location.  The service road and the tram circle (which acted as a sort of cul-de-sac for the two-lane road, with grass and trees in it's center) served the Security and First-Aid building and remained long into the 1980's.

This is a TOTAL nightmare and I am complete agreement with Harry regarding this issue.  Their comparison to both MGM and Marriott's success when going this route, is meaningless.  Customers of both of those brands are significantly different than those attending theme parks and neither of those brands offers either season passes, memberships, or requires an admission ticket to enter their properties.  The whole scheme sounds to me like a company that's moving to sell its real estate assets, leading to the eventual closing of their parks.  The man at the top made a huge mistake with his premium price/premium experience strategy and, personally, he should be sent packing.  Why he was brought in to begin with, is beyond me.  There needs to be an experienced theme park professional running this company, rather than some CFO turned CEO.  He, along with this Land and Buildings proposal, clearly want to maximize their investments before checking out, rather than operating theme parks.  GA is clearly the only park with significant real estate available for development, so Land and Buildings would be the real decider of which parks continue on as theme parks and which parks are sold-off for their real estate.  Where's John Dutton when we need him!

On 1/29/2023 at 6:07 PM, 29yrswithaGApass said:

I can't believe it has been ten years since I witnessed the demolition of the Conestoga Wagon on what was the coldest morning of the year.  Frigid temps (it was 7 degrees - not including the windchill) shutdown my iphone but I was happy my camera did not give out.  It was sad to see the Conestoga Wagon go, but if it meant saving the Safari, that was OK with me.

 Very sad to see this spotlight and agree that the time has passed so quickly.  The irony in all of this is that it really didn't save the Safari, it simply saved them the expense of repaving it at that time.  In fact, they lost the revenue provided from both the Conestoga Wagon when it operated in conjunction with the Arena, the TeePee as a merchandise shop, and the Safari as a separate gate.  As sad as it all is, in reality, it took COVID and the State's government intervention in closing businesses of every kind for Six Flags to realize that the Safari was their only viable revenue stream.  Just my thought, but the Safari attracts a very different demographic than the theme park and that difference has grown over time, as the theme park has become dominated by rollercoasters and eliminated (or severely diminished) shows.  At the time, I think they thought adding multiple kiddie sections to the theme park would draw in families with small children that otherwise might have only visited the Safari as a drive-thru.

Another example of Six Flags' failure to maintain basic park infrastructure to the point that should they ever decide to use something again, it will not be possible because it has deteriorated so badly.  I would hate to see the Great Arena demolished, but sadly, I believe  the company has largely eliminated shows at it parks, and has left most of its show venues sitting idol for quite some time.

Again, though, I keep going back to the CEOs desire to target guests and draw them to the parks for a premium experience at a premium price.  Just don't see how it's possible if you are unable to sell the entire park experience as a result of having virtually nothing but rollercoasters and thrill rides.